Yes, when you put a name to it people say they like them. When you say you are doing a specific things organizations like that support those efforts are mocked. Unless you want this to be a case of “don’t believe your lying eyes”.
I have been told, and have seen others get told, that they are wasting their time with incrementalist pipe dreams, when discussing actual things we are doing, things that that organizations like the PSL advocate. Most often those names have a .ml home instance, and this is ignoring the known trolls who are on their 1000th account on .world just trying to start fights. This happens regularly enough that I have all but stopped talking about it because I don’t want to have yet another person trying to argue that I need to be killing MAGA cultists, and blowing up infrastructure, or I am just another one of them. It became mind numbing. It did greatly reduce when I moved to an instance that blocks hexbear, which is probably why I have since been noticing the .ml names.
I have no way of making a genuine comparison because I don’t know what orgs you’re actually talking about. PSL and FRSO are overall seen very positively on all 3 of the Marxist-aligned instances. Further, neither Hex nor Lemmy.ml nor Grad advocate random adventurist terrorism.
You can only speak for yourself, but there are plenty of people on here, and other leftist spaces, that do just that. This does not seem to be a thing in person. Also, you keep getting hung up on the PSL’s reputation. Strip the association, and discuss the very specific things you are doing to advocate for your position, in real life, and you get that. Well maybe not you, as you have brand recognition with a lot of these twats, however, I assure you, it happens to others, fairly regularly, I am also talking about /c/'s not on .ml, .ml people. They have to behave at home.
I said their efforts, then clarified that when stripped of organization names, and laid out as the specific activities they advocate, those activities get this response.
Brand recognition, damn near everyone on lemmy knows your name
That’s flattering, I guess? Either way, I think what’s going on is the orgs I’m talking about and the ones you’re talking about are likely qualitatively different in strategies, but I can’t know without examples, so we are at an impasse.
The same day I post my update to you, this hits my home page
This is an example of what I am talking about. While this isn’t on .ml this is dbzero which is considered a contender for being considered part of “lemmygrad”
ok I will give you examples later when I have more free time.
So the three main vector’s of the PSL’s approach are :
Protests
Running Local Candidates
Education about socialism/workers rights
I have had many people absolutely just deny that protest, or running local candidates works, because ultimately you are being forced to operate within capitalists rules, so the system will not allow you to break through in these ways. While education its self is seen as important, it is seen as absolute minimal work, and we are far past the point for the first steps.
I can not tell you how many times I have been told, or seen comments discussing, how these are all impotent actions. Every time I see a somewhat healthy size thread discussing running candidates, I can almost guarantee I will see people just dismiss it all as electoralism, and then tell people how they need to be out enacting the revolution, which I feel means some forms of violence, though they can’t outright just say to go bomb places, and shoot people.
Protests are seen basically pointless because, if they were effective, they wouldn’t allow them to happen. If one becomes effective, they will just call in the military, crush it, and move on like nothing happened. Ironically, a lot of these people will also defend this type of things for places like China, in other threads.
There is a growing amount of online leftists who are certain the only thing left to do is war. I do not fully disagree, the US is getting to the point were peaceful means of conflict resolution are all being removed. However, the vast majority of these people are just keyboard warriors, which I have no respect for. I have seen people call for violence, then, buried in their history, there is a casual conversation where they admit they haven’t even been in a fight before.
I’m really confused what you’re referring to, most of the people I’ve seen shitting on PSL weren’t on .ml, but rather seemed to be Democrats mad that they ran as a third party for President.
refer to my later comment, it isn’t the organization name, it is a reaction to talking about doing the individual things, things they are doing, and being told it is worthless incrementalism
You’re being a little too vague for me to follow, what ‘individual things’ are you referring to getting called worthless incrementalism? You do sound like you have an axe to grind though I’m not sure about what
Yes, when you put a name to it people say they like them. When you say you are doing a specific things organizations like that support those efforts are mocked. Unless you want this to be a case of “don’t believe your lying eyes”.
I think you should discuss more, this isn’t the case in my experience.
I have been told, and have seen others get told, that they are wasting their time with incrementalist pipe dreams, when discussing actual things we are doing, things that that organizations like the PSL advocate. Most often those names have a .ml home instance, and this is ignoring the known trolls who are on their 1000th account on .world just trying to start fights. This happens regularly enough that I have all but stopped talking about it because I don’t want to have yet another person trying to argue that I need to be killing MAGA cultists, and blowing up infrastructure, or I am just another one of them. It became mind numbing. It did greatly reduce when I moved to an instance that blocks hexbear, which is probably why I have since been noticing the .ml names.
I have no way of making a genuine comparison because I don’t know what orgs you’re actually talking about. PSL and FRSO are overall seen very positively on all 3 of the Marxist-aligned instances. Further, neither Hex nor Lemmy.ml nor Grad advocate random adventurist terrorism.
You can only speak for yourself, but there are plenty of people on here, and other leftist spaces, that do just that. This does not seem to be a thing in person. Also, you keep getting hung up on the PSL’s reputation. Strip the association, and discuss the very specific things you are doing to advocate for your position, in real life, and you get that. Well maybe not you, as you have brand recognition with a lot of these twats, however, I assure you, it happens to others, fairly regularly, I am also talking about /c/'s not on .ml, .ml people. They have to behave at home.
I bring up PSL because you said they specifically were looked down upon originally. Also, not sure what you mean by “brand recognition.”
I said their efforts, then clarified that when stripped of organization names, and laid out as the specific activities they advocate, those activities get this response.
Brand recognition, damn near everyone on lemmy knows your name
That’s flattering, I guess? Either way, I think what’s going on is the orgs I’m talking about and the ones you’re talking about are likely qualitatively different in strategies, but I can’t know without examples, so we are at an impasse.
The same day I post my update to you, this hits my home page
This is an example of what I am talking about. While this isn’t on .ml this is dbzero which is considered a contender for being considered part of “lemmygrad”
ok I will give you examples later when I have more free time.
So the three main vector’s of the PSL’s approach are :
Protests Running Local Candidates Education about socialism/workers rights
I have had many people absolutely just deny that protest, or running local candidates works, because ultimately you are being forced to operate within capitalists rules, so the system will not allow you to break through in these ways. While education its self is seen as important, it is seen as absolute minimal work, and we are far past the point for the first steps.
I can not tell you how many times I have been told, or seen comments discussing, how these are all impotent actions. Every time I see a somewhat healthy size thread discussing running candidates, I can almost guarantee I will see people just dismiss it all as electoralism, and then tell people how they need to be out enacting the revolution, which I feel means some forms of violence, though they can’t outright just say to go bomb places, and shoot people.
Protests are seen basically pointless because, if they were effective, they wouldn’t allow them to happen. If one becomes effective, they will just call in the military, crush it, and move on like nothing happened. Ironically, a lot of these people will also defend this type of things for places like China, in other threads.
There is a growing amount of online leftists who are certain the only thing left to do is war. I do not fully disagree, the US is getting to the point were peaceful means of conflict resolution are all being removed. However, the vast majority of these people are just keyboard warriors, which I have no respect for. I have seen people call for violence, then, buried in their history, there is a casual conversation where they admit they haven’t even been in a fight before.
I’m really confused what you’re referring to, most of the people I’ve seen shitting on PSL weren’t on .ml, but rather seemed to be Democrats mad that they ran as a third party for President.
refer to my later comment, it isn’t the organization name, it is a reaction to talking about doing the individual things, things they are doing, and being told it is worthless incrementalism
You’re being a little too vague for me to follow, what ‘individual things’ are you referring to getting called worthless incrementalism? You do sound like you have an axe to grind though I’m not sure about what