• socsa@lemmy.ml
    12·
    1 year ago

    Yeah buddy, I’m not your monkey. If you want to have an actual conversation about why, eg, autocracy doesn’t do jack shit to resolve exploitation via labor alienation and commodification, I’m here for it. Or if you want to go over why the complete lack of actionable framework for curating the political agency of the individual is, in fact, one of the most glaring and widely discussed holes in Marxist orthodoxy, I’d love to pull that string.

    But if you are just going to be another smug sectarian who insists on making dishonest campist garbage the bottom of their moral well, then I guess we can keep taking pot shots at eachother. I just think the internet deserves a better class of socialist.

    • ThereRisesARedStar [she/her, they/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
      2·
      1 year ago

      Yeah buddy, I’m not your monkey.

      I’m sure you can definitely answer it, mhmm. Very believable.

      autocracy doesn’t do jack shit to resolve exploitation via labor alienation and commodification, I’m here for it.

      This demonstrates a lack of basic knowledge of theory as well as data on how AES have developed their workplaces.

      But who knows, might be wrong. What did you read that lead you to this conclusion?

      Or if you want to go over why the complete lack of actionable framework for curating the political agency of the individual is, in fact, one of the most glaring and widely discussed holes in Marxist orthodoxy

      Who is an orthodox marxist though? Also, youre going to have to define individual agency if you dont think AES states don’t cultivate it.

      But if you are just going to be another smug sectarian

      Literally in a left unity instance, you’re the one claiming the vast majority of socialists throughout the world are bad when you claim they’re all autocratic.

      • socsa@lemmy.ml
        22·
        1 year ago

        Yes, people who unironically support Leninism, Stalinism and Maoism are supporters of autocratic, and in many cases tyrannical politics. These are first principles for the vast majority of people who study politics, all over the world. It only feels strange because places like hexbear and lemmygrad have this extremely weird liturgy, where vaguely expressing any form of the idea that some forms of autocracy can be more evil than some forms of capitalism is the worst sin.

        Really, the only thing which is confusing to me is why anyone who espouses egalitarian and queer friendly principles would associate with people who actively promote a global alliance of countries who would exterminate them. I don’t condone association with campists for the same reason I don’t condone association with Republicans.

        • s0ykaf [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
          3·
          1 year ago

          some forms of autocracy can be more evil than some forms of capitalism is the worst sin.

          where i live a family of people born among the poorest 10% would take an average of nine generations to reach the middle class. nine. even ignoring the generational part, that’s about 20 million people condemned, by birth, to a life of deep poverty, lacking even the most basic goods such as food and housing. and we’re officially considered a “middle income” country.

          all, and i mean all AES states solved this problem either completely or nearly so by giving people decent jobs, education, health care and housing

          so yea it’s impossible for me to not find you people absolutely ridiculous when you talk shit about said states just because they “arrested too many citizens” or didn’t allow enough fucking free speech. you can rip my fucking tongue off if it means i don’t have to see my people getting fucked on a daily basis

          • socsa@lemmy.ml
            21·
            1 year ago

            Imagine believing that there is no poverty in China or Russia.

            • Clever_Clover [she/her]@hexbear.netEnglish
              3·
              1 year ago

              China

              the largest poverty alleviation campaign in modern history is too small for you to consider good?

              Russia

              we’re talking about AES, not capitalist states.

        • ThereRisesARedStar [she/her, they/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
          1·
          1 year ago

          Yes, people who unironically support Leninism, Stalinism and Maoism are supporters of autocratic, and in many cases tyrannical politics. These are first principles for the vast majority of people who study politics, all over the world.

          Most socialists in the world are some type of ml or maoist. Yes, I bet they teach in capitalist schools all over the world that the enemies of capitalism are some kind of monsters. But people actually exposed to socialism in practice seem to think much differently. The CPC has a 95 percent approval rating according to international pollsters. But Im guessing you know better than 1.3 billion Chinese folks about their government.

          Really, the only thing which is confusing to me is why anyone who espouses egalitarian and queer friendly principles would associate with people who actively promote a global alliance of countries who would exterminate them.

          Ah yes, the GDR and Cuba, well noted for their exterminationist policies.

          Socialist countries have a better track record with trans issues than capitalist countries at similar levels of wealth. Socialist countries also don’t create far right death squads all over the world that just happen to also exterminate queer folks. There is a reason why so many maoists in the Philippines are queer.

        • ShimmeringKoi [comrade/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
          1·
          1 year ago

          The biggest tell of someone who doesnt know anything about Marxism is someone who talks about “Stalinism” as if it’s a thing, as if Stalin himself wasn’t pretty much just a Leninist.